Road Force Balancing....

Discussion in 'The BS Topic' started by kenny77, Oct 31, 2020.

  1. kenny77

    kenny77 Veteran Member Lifetime Gold Member

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    So on my daily driver Challenger I've had a strange type of , feels like a wheel/tire tramping right between 65 and 75 mph. It's in the front. Been there since I got the car, not really a big deal but it's kinda been pisssing me off.

    Back to the Dealer where they do Road Force Balance with a Hunter machine. Get the car back, and the same thing still no difference. Talked to some people at work about it and one guy...who has a 78 Corvette Pace Car...told me to go to a shop in Hollywood that he uses, and let them look at it.

    Yesterday I take off work, to get to this urban little rinkey dink shop with a bunch of old Muscle Cars sitting outside. Explain what's going on to the guys there. They did the same Road Force balancing , but showed me where they were dis-mounting one of front tires and changing it's position on the rim.

    Test drove the car and that vibration is gone..gone..gone.. I mean, never been this smooth.
    Lesson learned as the guy said. Just because they have the right equipment ...it doesn't mean they know OR care enough to use it properly. Or care about you as a customer to even try.
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2021
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  2. ULTM8Z

    ULTM8Z Veteran Member

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    Good deal.

    Yeah I remember when I had my old Centerline wheels, the only way to get them to balance was road force balancing. Everytime I got new tires I'd have to get them balanced on the car. They were just lousy quality wheels.

    But ever since I went to the factory GM ZR1 style wheels, I can balance them like a normal car and its smooth as silk to well over 100 mph. That was the end of aftermarket wheels for me.
     
  3. GoldenOne7710

    GoldenOne7710 Equal Opportunity Offender Lifetime Gold Member

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    I worked a shop one time that sold tires. One of the old guys that worked there also drove a race car years before. He understood tires, suspension and chassis stuff and had it down to a science. He would mount a brand new tire on a rim...and if the initial balance called for more than .75 oz...he'd break it back down and spin it ¼ turn on the wheel. Would do it again and again if needed until he was satisfied.

    He end up installing a LOT of tires that required just ¼ oz weight and some times NO weights. He had the patience for it, whereas a lot of people don't. They'll just knock on the 2 or 3 oz it calls for the first time and call it good.
     
  4. biker

    biker Veteran Member

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    I worked in a tire shop for 5 summers as a kid, and a little known fact about new tires is that there is a dot on the tire that needs to line up with the valve. The area with the dot compensates for the weight of the valve, probably more important now with tpms sensors. Not a huge deal, but every little bit helps.
     
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  5. 72'z'steve

    72'z'steve Veteran Member

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    ^^^^^ My buddy used to manage a Firestone [poor guy] He tried to teach his tire jockeys about that dot,it actually made a fairly big difference on a set of tires on one of the blazers,he broke them down spun them around to the dot,less than .75 oz to balance-problem solved.Later Steve!!
     
  6. 1980RS

    1980RS Veteran Member

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    Over 25lbs on street tires and they are junk, truck tires over 50lbs. of road force and we would send those tires back.
     
  7. kenny77

    kenny77 Veteran Member Lifetime Gold Member

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    I'm learning this stuff for real...... The off the car road force balance is the best right now .

    I remember one time on the Camaro, a shop put this kinda plate like thing on my wheels...on the car...and spun the wheels up to whatever speed and added weights to balance the whole rotating assm. I talked to guys about it now, and I guess they're not old enough to have seen On-The-Car Balancing.
     
  8. NOT A TA

    NOT A TA Veteran Member

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    Having gone through this over and over with tire shops when I got tires for road course use on aftermarket wheels mounted I print this and bring it to the shop. If they don't understand I go elsewhere. I tell them uniformity method is preferred. You can imagine how irritating even a small vibration is when going well over 100 MPH on track.

    For factory wheels the dismount & turn method mentioned in others posts works to reduce weights required.

    From Yokohamas website
    1) Uniformity Method
    When performing uniformity match-mounting, the red mark on the tire, indicating the point of maximum radial force variation, should be aligned with the wheel assembly's point of minimum radial run-out, which is generally indicated by a colored dot or a notch somewhere on the wheel assembly (consult manufacturer for details). Radial force variation is the fluctuation in the force that appears in the rotating axis of a tire when a specific load is applied and the tire rotated at a specific speed. It is necessary to minimize radial force variation to ensure trouble-free installation and operation. Not all wheel assemblies indicate the point of minimum radial run-out, rendering uniformity match-mounting sometimes impossible. If the point of minimum radial run-out is not indicated on a wheel assembly, the weight method of match-mounting should be used.

    2) Weight Method
    When performing weight match-mounting, the yellow mark on the tire, indicating the point of lightest weight, should be aligned with the valve stem on the wheel assembly, which represents the heaviest weight point of the wheel assembly. After match-mounting by either of the above methods, the tire/wheel assembly can be balanced.

    Regardless of the match mounting method, proper lubrication is a must. Lubricate both top and bottom beads with an approved tire lubricant. If the beads do not seat at 40 psi, break the entire assembly down and lubricate the bead areas again.
     
  9. 1980RS

    1980RS Veteran Member

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    For us unfortuate guys who worked for Buick that where the road force stuff first showed it's ugly head on the Park Ave's in '97. We had those cars with a constant vibration at 63 mph and could not get rid of it even with tires of other Park Ave's. When we road forced the tires they were so bad that Buick sent us out 0 runout tires to fix the problem. I asked the Zone rep "what happens down the road when these people have to change tires at 60K" his reply was "it's out of the warranty period so not our problem". Road force tire testing for me has really helped with a lot of problem child customers in my time working back then.
     
  10. tom3

    tom3 Veteran Member

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    Used to work in a tire shop that we used this. A Hunter system. Spin the wheel and finger the weight and position rings to get the tires smooth. Used to open a door and watch the window for vibration. Best there was at the time. Tire quality had a lot to do with it too, Goodyear was the best back then. But today's road force - done right - really nails it down.
     

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