speedmaster (procomp) 3002 heads.

Discussion in 'High Performance Modifications' started by sooner, Mar 25, 2021.

  1. sooner

    sooner Veteran Member Lifetime Gold Member

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    Well in this thread: https://nastyz28.com/threads/the-best-chinese-heads-that-i-have-seen-to-date.334943/ I got ahold of a good set of cheap heads.

    After receiving the first set of heads, I bought 2 more sets of what was supposed to be the same heads. These were certainly not the same heads.

    Before I return them, I figured that I would measure a thing or two on them and snap a few pics.

    Intake port at pushrod pinch-> 1.990x1.05
    Intake bowl measured at center of valve guide-> 1.960 (big hump comes in right behind where I measured it at)
    Intake throat-> 1.803 (89.2%)
    Exhaust bowl-> 1.377 (86%)
    Exhaust throat-> 1.380 (86.2...yes bigger than bowl)

    First off, these are just ugly. This is the first set of the new generation of procomp heads that I have held in my hands. I have bought several different sets of Chinese heads over the course of the last year, but never had any interest in these because of the way that they look. Silly, I know but im just crazy like that. They just look cheap.

    IMG_3652[1].JPG
    These seem to have the same "ridge around the intake valve" problem that the flotek 180's that I bought had out of the box, albeit not quite as bad.
    IMG_3666[1].JPG
    The valve job is pretty sorry. It is not a radiused valve job by any means and there are just sharp corners where the angles come in. Not inconsistent with what I usually get on Chinese heads, just FYI.
    IMG_3654[1].JPG
    The first thing that sticks out is that there is a MASSIVE hump in the casting where the head bolt hole goes through the common wall.
    IMG_3658[1].JPG
    Then looking down the port, the roof is as flat as a board. No arc of any kind leading into the long radius (roof) of the port.
    IMG_3656[1].JPG
    The bottom cut of the valve job is blended pretty well and symmetrically to bowl, but there is some funkyness in the short turn area (left side in the pic) where the huge hump starts to protrude into the bowl.
    IMG_3660[1].JPG
    Port alignment shift is pretty consistent with what I have seen on the Chinese stuff. This is a 1206 in the picture that has been trimmed on the top a bit. I meant to measure how much material that there is in the pushrod pinch area should you want to widen that...but I forgot to do it and I don't plan on getting them back out of the box.
    IMG_3657[1].JPG

    I don't have any interest in keeping or porting these. I think that it would take a ton of work to make them "good", and I don't expect them to do much out of the box after looking them over.
     
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  2. BonzoHansen

    BonzoHansen Administrator Lifetime Gold Member

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    Wow. I am enjoying your reviews, thanks.
     
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  3. 1980RS

    1980RS Veteran Member

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    And I still have people wonder why I say stock Vortec heads are better than most of those aftermarket cheapo heads. I think there is a guy on line that calls himself BOOT and he has some good reviews on the different good and bad ebay aluminum SBC heads.
     
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  4. John Wright

    John Wright Veteran Member Lifetime Gold Member

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    Same
     
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  5. G72Zed

    G72Zed Veteran Member

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  6. sooner

    sooner Veteran Member Lifetime Gold Member

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    The rising prices of vortec heads are what got me interested with these Chinese heads to begin with. I did pick up a set of vortecs a few months back on ebay that I gave around $380 to my door for. I still think that is fair for the product that you get, but honestly those deals are getting more and more rare. That's what got me looking for an alternative that would perform similarly.

    After porting several sets of chinese heads, I don't necessarily believe that they are all made from inferior material. As far as the heat treat on them, I did have one bowl on the Flotek's that kept on gumming up my double cut SE5 which led me to believe that the material was soft and possibly not heat treated correctly. Every other thing that I have ground on chipped off as you would expect good T356 to chip. Equal to any factory LT1 or LS head that I have done any thing with. I realize that is not equivalent to a formal hardness test, but after spending a couple decades doing CNC machine work crappy soft material is generally pretty easy to read just by the chips it produces and how your tools behave/wear when cutting it.

    I actually do have access to a metallurgy lab...and metallurgist that I'm pretty sure that I could coax to check a head out. Brinell hardness check would be no problem, however if checking composition id have to cut one in half or at least cut a corner off of one with a band saw. If someone wanted to go in halves on a head I would take one out there, cut it, get a composition analysis done on it, take pics/gather data and report back. Would prefer to cut one of the Pro1 style copies as they seem to be the best that china has to offer.

    I do plan to do a Brinell check on the Flotek's as I am planning to use them on my own junk. Just have too much work in them to cut one into pieces for a comp analysis.
     
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  7. Coadster32

    Coadster32 Veteran Member Lifetime Gold Member

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    I have 3002 heads on my 383 stroker. Car came with them, and had the car for about 6 years now, 15,000 miles. I had them redone at a local machine shop last year, as I had a blown head gasket. Personally, I am am a foreman in a CNC machine job shop, so I know my way around junk parts and not. The 3002's I took off my car, I inspected before I handed them over to the shop, and then again at their shop as well. Seems as though I lucked out on my heads. I have read where their quality took a real nose dive only a couple years in. The valve guides from a Big Block fit into the heads that I have. Car heads are back on, and have over 2K on them. They seem to be pretty good. Performance wise, I'm not a guru by any means if they are awesome heads or not, but just couldn't justify buying new heads at the time.

    The heads you posted look junky as you have clearly shown. Thank you for doing this, I'd be upset if I paid money for them looking like that.
     
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  8. sooner

    sooner Veteran Member Lifetime Gold Member

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    I have never ran the procomp heads personally, but what I have read about them is consistent with what you posted. A guy that I used to work with had a pair of the very early ones on his bracket car. He did have some geometry trouble with his set, but again these would have been heads from probably the 2005ish era. I think his were the 210's and despite the issues that he had with them his car ran pretty good.

    The main reason that I am comfortable buying the Chinese stuff is because of my experience in the machine shop myself. Its pretty easy to spot the red flags, variances in material, hardness ect when they are all things that you deal with day in and day out with all kinds of different parts in that line of work. The real comfort factor is that we either own, or have access to pretty much any kind of applicable measuring tool imaginable for the task at hand. Anything from simple dial calipers to CMM machines, faro arms, ect...generally can find a measuring tool to measure anything you doubt.

    Honestly if they didn't have the big hump on the common wall of the intake ports, and the roof of the intake port didn't appear to be designed after a stock smogger era SBC head I would probably have kept them and worked on them. After the flotek experience though, I just wasn't up to removing that much material again. I just think that right now there are some better options if only looking within the Chinese cylinder head market. Just my opinion on them

    The seller on ebay seems like they are going to take care of me on these. I printed labels and sent them all back today. They explained that they are selling 2 different heads under the same posting. From the seller: "They are both speedmaster\pro comp heads PCE 2841.1798 or pc3002". The "PCE2841.1798" were the first ones that I got and are pretty good IMO.
    I explained to the seller that they should really be sold under 2 different listings since the heads are completely different port designs. I don't know if they will listen or not, but I figured that is was worth a shot.

    There are some Chinese heads floating around that appear to be either a Brodix or Profiler copy by just looking at the pictures of them. I haven't been able to find any bare ones yet, but if I do those will be the next ones that I pick up.
     
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  9. G72Zed

    G72Zed Veteran Member

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    First off, Thanks for sharing your perspectives and the pic's of your head castings and porting journey showing the details of the castings. Like you, I look at the over shape of the ports and chamber, from that, it's easy to see core shift and if they new what makes a good head in the first place. Looks like your luck ran out on the 2nd round.

    I work on the "main stream" stuff, and have not done any "offshore" stuff untill now....

    I'm building a 500 BBC for a customer and using these somewhat NEW castings that I believe are offshore. Come in a kit form, and the price was right, no porosity or core shift issues to speak of, or that the eye can pick up, and the shape of the ports are real, real nice, I was pleasantly surprised by this.

    Have them on the SF1020 before and after, then we will see how they work, and what kind of HP they can support. Don't get me wrong, they need work and some massaging, but I'm real impressed with them up till now. time will tell.


    chamber.jpg port1.jpg
     
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  10. sooner

    sooner Veteran Member Lifetime Gold Member

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    Very nice work sir, impressive! That chamber looks fantastic, beautiful radius into the top cut. It takes a very steady hand to do work like that and not have an "oops" when the cutter pops out of the radius and nicks the deck.

    Love the bowl work as well, and the blend into the port. Looks very nice. What size did you make the bowls (if you can share that).

    I absolutely HATE doing chambers....especially if I have to use that damn round burr. That thing will jump around on you if you don't strong arm it. I'm probably one of the only people in the world that finds any value at all in a (good) cnc chamber head. It just saves a lot of work.

    Love the bowl work as well, and the blend into the port. What size did you make the bowls?

    Which head is that? is it a 345?
     

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